Alton Towers Latest Rumours/confirmations

[Coaster-Fiend]

I mean it can't get worse than rita... can it?

I think RITA could have been better, but having said that it does 0-60mph in what... little over a second. It's a fast launch, it's got some tight turns and the hills produce good airtime. It's not a bad ride really. Much better than I thought it was going to be, and quite thrilling. 8/10.

 

[Smithy]

The case for a wooden coaster is stronger than most, mainly due to Wardley's influence, the previous plans etc...

However, the worlds first tag has been taken way, way too seriously by some people. Yes, it could mean that we have a unique ride, but that doesn't mean it will be a launched woody. What was the budget, 12 million? Yeah, have fun creating that one. Could you imagine how quickly a wooden coaster would rip itself to pieces through the heavy strain of a launch? It would need retracking practically every year. And logically, why would they launch it? You say they need to do so, because they can't build a high lift hill, but then how intense would a launch and then a drop into the valley be? Unless it's a slow kind of launch, but then that's pointless as you can get a fairly small lift hill in under the tree line.

 

[Jools]

I'm putting my money on a ground hugging or crater coaster

 

[Harvey]

I mean it can't get worse than rita... can it?

Seems that every time I go it has a queue, God it must be terrible.

 

[Gazza]

Could you imagine how quickly a wooden coaster would rip itself to pieces through the heavy strain of a launch? It would need retracking practically every year

Why would it have any extra strain? Many larger woodies operate in the 90-110km/h range. Excluding the super large record breaking launchers, many launched coasters also operate in the 90-110km/h range.
Are you saying if there were two coasters with identical layouts, but one had a launch that got the train to say 100km/h, and one had a drop that got the train to 100km/h, the layout of the first woodie would suffer far more damage?

The track of the launch isn't under any special strain. Things like the mechanical systems, launch cable, friction tyres or whatever definitely are, but not the track.

Think about it this way. At the bottom of the first drop of El Toro the train is doing 112km/h, but not only that, the track is supporting 3 or 4 times the weight of the train, due to the G forces (How many G's does El Toro pull UC? Im assuming between 3g and 4g)
So day in day out, trains whip along that section of track at 112km/h exerting 3 or 4 times the train weight on it.

Now, compare with a launch track. The track is flat, and not curving, so no addtional vertical g forces occur. Therefore the track only has to support the train weight, and not a multiple of it. Lets say this coaster also launches to 112km/h. So day in, day out, trains whip over this section of track at 112km/h, exterting one times the train weight on it.

So what can we conclude? The launch track would have far less strain on it than some track elements on existing woodies, and the rest of the layout wouldn't need to be built any differently...It doesn't know how the train got to top speed.

Ill admit that the concept of a launched woodie is pretty unconventional. But at the same time I think it has its applications. Imagine a ride like Powder Keg. You would be able to have the launch to fit in with the story line, but the rest of the ride would retain a rustic feel that fits in well with the old time theme. I dont see a reason to be so closed minded to the idea of launched woodies popping up a parks...There's thematic potential, you can market the idea of a wild ride in all aspects, there would be a lower cost of construction than a steel launched coaster, and you never know, it might be fun.


That said, I'm not assuming one is going to AT because of what S&S said, or any other reason yadayadayada.

 

[Smithy]

Gaz, it's the power and vibrations from the launch that will practically tear it apart if it's wooden. I'll believe it would work when I see it,

I wasn't on about speed throughout the ride, I was on about force on the rider with a launch AND drop into the valley. The ride tearing itself apart would be from the vibrations and stress put under the track by the launch.

 

[Anonymous]

T(How many G's does El Toro pull UC? Im assuming between 3g and 4g)

I'm not UC but our log's say 4.5 g's.

And I think that a Intamin P'n'P track would easily handle the strains/vibrations that a launch produce, other wooden tracks may also be able to cope with them. There is no way to give any real predictions of how a wooden launcher will work, until someone actually builds one.

 

[Harvey]

Gaz, it's the power and vibrations from the launch that will practically tear it apart if it's wooden. I'll believe it would work when I see it,

Steel tracking for the launch section, just like SoB used steel tracking for the looooooooooop.

Sod me I better phone Intamin and sell them an idea like that, pronto.

 

[Jools]

Sorry guys, I just can't imagine 2 launched coasters in an area, or that close anyway.

 

[Blaze]

Sorry guys, I just can't imagine 2 launched coasters in an area, or that close anyway.

thats why I made the topic about what it wont be-so impossible ideas can be realised and shot down, while plausible ideas can be discussed over the next 6-12 months or so until we find out what it is

 

[Dave]

And it differed from this topic?

 

[Blaze]

This topic is about what it could be, and is full of wild and innacurate guesses. Mine was about sorting out all these suggestions to decide what to believe and what it could be, also, this topic is for everything to do with AT, not just what SW6 will be

 

[SaiyanHajime]

blaze123... Within a topic as broad as this, you can steer the conversation into a specific area if you want. Your topic was closed because this topic is so broad. You can go over what SW6 will not be in this topic if you want.

Notthatiseeaproblemwithofftopicnessinthefirstplace.

 

[Gazza]

Gaz, it's the power and vibrations from the launch that will practically tear it apart if it's wooden. I'll believe it would work when I see it,

I wasn't on about speed throughout the ride, I was on about force on the rider with a launch AND drop into the valley. The ride tearing itself apart would be from the vibrations and stress put under the track by the launch.

Why does it have to drop into the valley?

In any case, the layout of any coaster has to have safe g force levels, so you'd never have a part of the ride damaging itself because you'd never have a ride with g forces so strong as to harm riders and damage the structure it is built on.

I still don't see where you are going with the 'power and vibrations of the launch"....The train is the thing being launched, and not the track, so the track itself doesn't have any special loads on it.

Take a cable based launch. The launch sled speeds along its own little track in the middle of the main one. When the train launches, there is no additional forces that compresses, tension, or shear the structure of the coaster, because the launch hardware is putting all its energy into moving the train...it isn't pulling on the structure or whatever.

As for Magnetic launches, look at this pic:
http://www.rcdb.com/ig640.htm?picture=11
On woodies track mounted equipment is already put on steel beams, so naturally they would do the same for the LIM/LSM units, so no problems with anything getting ripped apart.

Vibrations is a new one....I have never found launches on coasters to vibrate much anyway, plus the structure of a woodie shakes a bit when trains run anyway...It's got some give.

 

[Smithy]

So why did most of Voyage have to get re tracked after just one season then?

I'm talking long term effects, not something that's going to happen twice a season.

And with the space they've got, it's pretty much going to have to go towards the valley otherwise the ride length will be tiny.

 

[costar]

Personally I can't fault anything Gazza is saying. Even if it accelerated to, say, 72kph in 1 second that's only 20m/s (since there are 3600 secs in an hour, work it out) i.e. 2 x 10m/s per second, or in other words, 2 g !

So, you can see that launch accelerations are nothing compared to what the train does at the bottom of a hill (4.5g, thanks loefet) and the structure could easily cope. Not that it really matters because, as Gaz says, the force goes straight to the catch car or whatever is doing the launching so the structure won't know much about it.

Also I don't really see why it has to go into the valley (I'm not even sure they will get that one past the planners from past experience). And even if it did go into the valley, there's nothing saying you have to launch then drop. The launch could be used as a means of getting back out of the valley, i.e. take place later in the ride. I'm fairly sure this was considered for the cross valley coaster in 2003.

Basically, a launched woody IS possible. It is an unlikely choice I think but with a good theme AT could pull it off. In my opinion a suprise launch at the back of the ride could work. There really isn't much more to say... and yet this topic will clearly go a few more pages on the subject...

 

[Gazza]

So why did most of Voyage have to get re tracked after just one season then?

Because it was built by GG :lol:

 

[Stone Cold]

Has everyone forgotten the Incredible Hulk, now that's got a launch that any wooden coaster could handle. You might well think why would they want that, but if they were building a coaster out into the valley, a launch at the end would be a suitable way to get it back to the station, and for the ride to be thrilling right up until the end.

^The above is conjecture. It's obvious that AT are getting a triple racing Arrow Pipeline coaster, why else would JW be back unless it was to settle an old score, and SW2 + SW2 + SW2 = SW6. Coincidence, I think not!

 

[Mark]

Coincidence, I think not!

Sarcasm you in great I suspect :starwars:

I have given up the ghost with the guessing, or even conjecture to be honest. Launch woodie... next to Rita? Sounds bizarre to me, which actually makes me think it could be a possibility. Especially as Stone puts it, it needn't be some massive launch. Why, because it is Alton Towers.

 

[SaiyanHajime]

Personally I can't fault anything Gazza is saying. Even if it accelerated to, say, 72kph in 1 second that's only 20m/s (since there are 3600 secs in an hour, work it out) i.e. 2 x 10m/s per second, or in other words, 2 g !

So, you can see that launch accelerations are nothing compared to what the train does at the bottom of a hill (4.5g, thanks loefet) and the structure could easily cope. Not that it really matters because, as Gaz says, the force goes straight to the catch car or whatever is doing the launching so the structure won't know much about it.

Also I don't really see why it has to go into the valley (I'm not even sure they will get that one past the planners from past experience). And even if it did go into the valley, there's nothing saying you have to launch then drop. The launch could be used as a means of getting back out of the valley, i.e. take place later in the ride. I'm fairly sure this was considered for the cross valley coaster in 2003.

Basically, a launched woody IS possible. It is an unlikely choice I think but with a good theme AT could pull it off. In my opinion a suprise launch at the back of the ride could work. There really isn't much more to say... and yet this topic will clearly go a few more pages on the subject...

I enjoyed this post.


I've never understood why people keep discrediting the launched woodie idea saying it's pointless. In a park which cannot build too tall, makes sense to me.