Is Nemesis the world's best inverted coaster?

[SaiyanHajime]

I'd say having an opinion is basic human rights, no need to be thankful...

I think Batman gets overlooked due to how many people have ridden it, personally. The odd coasters that fewer people have ridden get more attention.

That's why, worldwide, Nemesis is far more renowned that it is just int he UK.

 

[furie]

I've said this before, and while there is little difference between all the inverts (IMO), there IS a difference.

See, I thought the Batman rides were incredibly intense. Considerably faster and harsher than Nemesis. However, I didn't think it was a good thing, I just didn't want to reride the coaster as it was just too forceful.

Others (probably looking at Great Bear here) have their moments, but they're a gentler ride and kind of fun. The bit I enjoyed most about Alpengeist was the twisting track above the fake snow run. Sod the height and inversions, it was that section (where most people say the ride dies and is crap) that I adored. It set it apart from the other inverts because it changed the ride halfway through.

Inferno I also find great fun. The drop out of the station is an excellent warm up and the ride is good fun. It's fast and relentless, but it never really (unless you get it on a very good day) hits the high forces Nemesis and Batman can manage. So it's great fun, like all of them, it's a good ride.

The point here is that it's all about what you personally get from the rides. Nemesis absolutely has a poor ending, even the forced "surprise" roll near the end doesn't really save it. It's lost a lot of momentum and the pacing drops off. For a short ride, that's not a good thing. However, Nic covers it, in the way that the ride is about more than just the ride. It's the entire experience that builds the ride up and the ride (until the loop) absolutely delivers on the promise.

What it delivers may not be what you enjoy from an invert though. Maybe you want constant fast and high forces like Batman, or maybe your body just doesn't like that and prefers something a little lighter? Possibly you want variation, or constant hits (like Infusion gives)?

In other words, it's all completely subjective :lol:

I will say, time and again (even though I don't believe in 'specific time in specific seats' as an argument for why a ride is good) - Late October/Early November, night riding Nemesis is unlike anything it offers at any other time. It is mind blowing, the way the coaster comes to life. It doesn't stop for a second and it's just a brutal assault on your senses. Back right is the best seat for it, but even front row, it's knock out.

 

[nealbie]

A basic human right not afforded to some by other members though ("Shut up you have no right to have an opinion!")

Nemesis is fab though, and the best I've been on thus far. Although B&M inverts are all very consistent (except Inferno - which isn't pants, it just lacks that special something) and sit proudly 2nd-6th in my top 10 (Nemesis, Oz, Monster, Mamba). But I'm not allowed an opinion *nods*

I really want to try a Batman, and hopefully will in Madrid next year, because it may be an off-the-shelf copy but it's still better than having ANOTHER SLC, right? =P

 

[furie]

I've never understood why Inferno gets such a knocking. I think it's a great ride personally and while I don't think it's as good as Nemesis, it's still really good. It's just a bit short and stops the moment you start enjoying it - but that's Thorpe's motto "stop just as they start to enjoy it"

 

[nealbie]

Haha! Sounds about right.

As I said though, it really is a solid ride and I don't understand why it's slated either. But it lacks the "special" aura that the others I have ridden possess. Best way I can think of explaining what I mean is that Inferno is a 9/10 and all the other Inverts I've ridden are 10/10.

 

[marc]

I actually like inferno as well for me it's better than the dragons at IoA. Yes it could go on longer, but when it's running fast at the end of the day I'm glad it's the length it is.

Montu I want to like and yes I like it but it just dies and that is my lasting memory as its just before the coaster ends.

Mamba I like the zero g was my favourite until Oz and that over took it.

Batmans are very fast and intense, you have no idea what's going on and I had no time to actually enjoy the coaster.

 

[nadroJ]

Eurgh, the Batman clones! What a gross excuse for a coaster. This is where the American approach to what is a good coaster falls down. Hey, I know, let's batter the **** out of our riders and throw so much force and speed at them that they feel physically sick and never want to ride this coaster again when they get off, because that's what makes a good coaster, right?

No no no just no. Hence why Nemesis is better, it's got the force but doesn't overwhelm you with it so when you get off all you want to do is run round and jump straight back on it. And that is what makes a good coaster ;]

 

[SaiyanHajime]

I've never understood why Inferno gets such a knocking. I think it's a great ride personally and while I don't think it's as good as Nemesis, it's still really good. It's just a bit short and stops the moment you start enjoying it - but that's Thorpe's motto "stop just as they start to enjoy it"

I don't get the Inferno hate too. It's one of the more intense one's, in my opinion. Kyle couldn't understand why it gets slated so much, either.

I'd certainly say it's better than the Dragon's and Raptor, at the very least.

My opinion of the inverts overall is very much that they are all solid, good rides. The problem is they, like you say, are all a bit samey.

I feel sorry for Great Bear, and Hersheypark as a whole sometimes. They've never really produced anything "outstanding" until Skyrush. It's a whole load of "good" there, and that's sometimes less impressive than one awesome coaster amongst a sea of crap. Great Bear's drop into the helix is awesome. It's awesome the same way Big One's turn around is awesome. You are SO far off the ground, just casually milling about. Ridiculous, unusual and amazing.

Eurgh, the Batman clones! What a gross excuse for a coaster. This is where the American approach to what is a good coaster falls down. Hey, I know, let's batter the out of our riders and throw so much force and speed at them that they feel physically sick and never want to ride this coaster again when they get off, because that's what makes a good coaster, right?

I'd say you're wrong here, because that isn't the American approach at all. The American approach is to build it as big and as fast as possible, or built something pointlessly retro, which usually results in tame, giant coasters which look imposing but don't feel it, or tamid looking wooden coasters which are scarily intense. It's certainly true of the inverts. Nemesis and Inferno are both more intense than everything except Batman, and that's probably because Batman was the first and no other reason

 

[Martyn B]

Another Inferno lover here! I do love Nemesis, but I find Inferno more enjoyable. Less intense, more fun.

Same can be said for Batman > Nemesis. Batman la Fuga was just too intense to be enjoyable really, and even the amazing queue line (plus it being walk on) couldn't tempt me to more than 3/4 rides per day.

Like Jordan said, I think Nemesis got the balance perfectly.

I'd put Oz and DD: Ice in the Inferno bracket: good solid fun. With Montu keeping DD: Fire and Nemesis company: intense and fun.

 

[Taxi]

I just wish Europe could get another world-renowned coaster. Hopefully B&M gets it together soon. SW8 anyone?

 

[nadroJ]

^but there are lots of good B&M coasters in Europe, it's just that they're not exactly marketed overseas. Even in the UK, apart from Disney the only European park we're ever really told about is Port Aventura. Hence why I think Nemesis is perhaps more well known, Alton Towers as a location is easily marketable as a holiday destination overseas, whereas somewhere like Mirabilandia (and Katun) are less likely to receive the same international publicity.

 

[Taxi]

Well, my European bucket list is pretty small. But these seem to be the best of the best

-Expedition GeForce
-Goliath
-Blue Fire
-Colossos (HP)
-Nemesis
-Black Mamba
-Wodan Timbur Coaster

Sounds like a great time to me.

 

[Montario]

Wow...I did not intend for you guys to take what I said seriously. I'm not going to lie, it did bug me a little (otherwise I wouldn't have replied!), but I did not expect people to pick up on it as if it was a big issue to me. I wasn't serious, I wasn't complaining either.

On topic, some of you probably did not understand what I was trying to get across about the Batman clones, so I'll make it clearer. The ride itself has a perfectly intense and rather compact layout. It is re-ridable to a relatively high extent and maintains an enjoyable pace. The elements are simple, yet the way they are ordered is effective. I have a strange obsession with inverted loops, so 2 loops makes the ride experience great for me in that sense. Despite all these points, I'm still not convinced the layout is anything special however, and does not deserve all the hype.

Here is where everything crumbles for me. The fact that this ride is cloned in almost every six flags park makes it not too amazing to me anymore. After a while the ride will seem very redundant, even sometimes a little bit dull. Very little effort has been put into themeing the ride, which is another reason why I prefer Nemesis. The psychological fear or excitement is not there which makes the experience a little bit boring (then again, a lot of rides have little to no themeing).

I guess you could say my fondness of this ride started off high, but died down drastically due to these factors. I really want to try out Diavlo or Lighning though, see how they compare. I hope this is much clearer, I don't want people to get the wrong impression.

 

[Taxi]

Wow...I did not intend for you guys to take what I said seriously. I'm not going to lie, it did bug me a little (otherwise I wouldn't have replied!), but I did not expect people to pick up on it as if it was a big issue to me. I wasn't serious, I wasn't complaining either.

On topic, some of you probably did not understand what I was trying to get across about the Batman clones, so I'll make it clearer. The ride itself has a perfectly intense and rather compact layout. It is re-ridable to a relatively high extent and maintains an enjoyable pace. The elements are simple, yet the way they are ordered is effective. I have a strange obsession with inverted loops, so 2 loops makes the ride experience great for me in that sense. Despite all these points, I'm still not convinced the layout is anything special however, and does not deserve all the hype.

Here is where everything crumbles for me. The fact that this ride is cloned in almost every six flags park makes it not too amazing to me anymore. After a while the ride will seem very redundant, even sometimes a little bit dull. Very little effort has been put into themeing the ride, which is another reason why I prefer Nemesis. The psychological fear or excitement is not there which makes the experience a little bit boring (then again, a lot of rides have little to no themeing).

I guess you could say my fondness of this ride started off high, but died down drastically due to these factors. I really want to try out Diavlo or Lighning though, see how they compare. I hope this is much clearer, I don't want people to get the wrong impression.

I agree 100% with that statement. The ride is great, just the fact that the ride has been cloned so-many times is what gets me. That's where Nemesis shines, it has originality and a theme.

 

[Martyn B]

But surely a great ride being cloned is a good thing?

 

[nadroJ]

I think what they mean is that it becomes less of a rarity and therefore less special when you ride it? One major thing that Nemesis has going for it is that it does something that no other coaster does, something that cannot be said of the Batman clones.

It sort of is a good thing because it means more people get to ride what many believe to be a great coaster, but at the same time it loses something and perhaps becomes boring to see the same thing appearing again and again in parks across the country?

 

[marc]

Everyone tends to forget about katan, which tbh is my joint number 4 invert with montu.

Is it due to the fact not many people have been on it?

 

[nealbie]

Is it better than an SLC? (Don't know, as previously mentioned I'm yet to ride a Batman) But I'd imagine so, so it's not a bad thing. Obviously could be better, but like Inferno being less than special albeit forceful, it's still a B&M Invert rather than a Vekoma SLC.... so for what it is I don't see the problem?

 

[owentaylor121]

Well, my European bucket list is pretty small. But these seem to be the best of the best

-Expedition GeForce
-Goliath
-Blue Fire
-Colossos (HP)
-Nemesis
-Black Mamba
-Wodan Timbur Coaster

Sounds like a great time to me.

Stop now bfore you come across as stupid. You just listed 7 coasters what are the best in Europe. Even though Wodan is always being slated like. :roll:

You missed out,
Dragon Khan.
Shambhala.
Ispeed.
Superman (PWM)
And many others.

 

[Taxi]

Eh, Maverick has me covered in the ispeed department. Shambhala is just another cookie-cutter b&m. Dragon Khan and Superman look promising though.