WTF BPB?

[Smithy]

I have a suspicion that the vast majority of people STILL complaining about the lack of free entry were the type who either never went anyway, or if they did they would barely spend anything. And financially they're much better off catering to those who pay to go for the day than they are those who want the ability to wander around freely and maybe buy a hot dog.

We've said on here for YEARS now that to capture the UK public's mind with marketing you HAVE to have some element of uniqueness to advertise so that people can use it to boast. Icon is a great little coaster that could have been marketed so much better than it was. And whilst the infatuation with Hot Ice continues to be a running joke, the reality is Amanda would probably sooner see BPB as a park close than she would to stop putting on those shows.

 

[rob666]

My wife used to have an entry (diamond) season pass, and would easily spend a couple of hundred quid in the bar over the season, to meet me after the shops.
Gave me an extra hour on the coasters, and her a safe place to meet up, with familiar faces behind the bar.
She hasn't been on the park now in three years.
Keep gated entry, but bring back a non ride ticket, easy to do if they insist on checking your pass at every ride entry still.

 

[Coastercal]

I’m a taxi driver in the area local to pleasure beach and often get a few staff a day on their way to work in the car.

Today I had someone tell me that so far this year the most they’ve had on the park was 9000 and quite a few days they’ve struggled to even make 1000. Apparently the average is a lot less than in years gone by where each day would easily pull in 15k this time of year.


Also had a hot ice arena worker in. Tells me that the arena holds 1600 and most nights of the week struggles to pull in 10% of that.

Says it all really. Priorities in the wrong places.

 

[Matt N]

I’m a taxi driver in the area local to pleasure beach and often get a few staff a day on their way to work in the car.

Today I had someone tell me that so far this year the most they’ve had on the park was 9000 and quite a few days they’ve struggled to even make 1000. Apparently the average is a lot less than in years gone by where each day would easily pull in 15k this time of year.


Also had a hot ice arena worker in. Tells me that the arena holds 1600 and most nights of the week struggles to pull in 10% of that.

Says it all really. Priorities in the wrong places.

Blimey, those numbers are low... I'd have had Blackpool down as a park that easily got 10,000+ on a number of weekends. I wonder why the park is so under-visited these days?

I do also wonder how many visitors the park actually gets each year these days. I always assumed that it was right up there with the likes of Alton Towers, if not even higher, as back in the 2000s, they got 5-6 million guests per year, making them by far the most visited UK park and 2nd only to Disneyland Park in Paris in Europe (as per the TEA/AECOM Theme Index). However, their conspicuous absence from the TEA/AECOM top 25 most visited parks in Europe ever since the introduction of the entry fee, as well as your post above, would suggest otherwise...

 

[RevolutionRuleZ]

Its very straightforward, BPB is part of Blackpool for the majority of people, its not the soul purpose of a day in the resort.

A lot of people want to arrive and find somewhere for breakfast, take the kids on the Big Wheel, visit a few other attractions, walk through a few arcades and call into BPB.

By the time they get there they find is closing within a few hours, and an entry fee that granny doesn't see any point paying, and then little jonny has a melt down cause he wants to go on the Big One.

Its not like inland parks, you don't go to Uttoxeter for any other reason than Alton Towers, but BPB is a very different thing.


They are missing out on thousands of people spending a ton of money with the entry fee.

As a child, the reason my parents took me to BPB was the free entry, they would occasionally have a ride themselves but generally were happy enough watching me. As I got more into coasters I asked about Alton Towers and was flatly refused because they wouldn't pay to get in, by todays standards of parenting that sounds cruel, tight and old fashioned, but I bet it still stands for some, and I think its working against BPB now.

I mean in todays climate, how good would the USP be to be free entry out of all the major players in the country? Make the punters feel they are getting a deal then empty their wallets once you have them in? I cant be the only person who burnt through a sheet of ride tickets in about 90 minutes then went back to buy more!

Surely its better to let two parents in for free, and let them spend £50 on 2 kids to have 5-6 rides each, then have the pestering for more than the entire family not even go in?


If BPB want to know the honest truth why they are quite they could do a lot worse than to send ambassadors out onto the promenade on a weekend between 2-5pm around the golf/South pier and a few more up by Central/coral island, armed with clip boards and ask people two very simple questions:

1. Have you been into BPB today?

2. If no, why?

And I can tell you know what the results would be, and they wouldn't like the answers which is presumably why they won't do it.

 

[rob666]

Free entry used to mean massive crowds, many not spending a penny, football mob riots, petty thieves and pickpockets.
Paid gated entry was much better, a tenner, with a few family rides chucked in, as it used to be, right up to covid.

 

[RevolutionRuleZ]

But for all those not spending anything, (ie my mum and dad on some occasions) they brought with them people who would spend, regardless of if that be a child or family or friends while they held coats. And if a civilised person is in there and not actually spending anything, what harm are they doing? At least having the park somewhat busy gives some atmosphere. The weekend before last we sat at FY4 and the park was soulless, completely flat.

In fairness you can get pick-pocketed in a supermarket, you don't see Asda charging an entrance fee to get around that problem. And as for football riots, how far back are we going here? Again, put a system in place to deal with it. Thats like a pub shutting or refusing to show the world Cup incase people get a bit angry when England get put on a flight home, it doesn't happen, instead they put a doorman on or a couple of extra staff behind the bar and cash in.

I'm not suggesting incidents wouldn't ever happen, but something has to give here. Geoffrey used to aim to take £1 from every visitor who came to Blackpool, of course some didn't go in BPB or as you say, some went in and didn't spend, but for everyone of those, there were people like you and I spending far more than £1 so he ended up on top anyway. The point is the park make no money from people outside the gates, you have to get them in, entice them to spend, who cares if its on food, drink, a hoodie, a hat, one ride or twenty rides. Take whatever, I really don't think they can afford to be picky at this stage.

 

[rob666]

Football, you are going back to pre paid entry...it happened, a lot.
Most away fans went to the Beach for a few rides and beers after the match, and it got very rowdy back in the days of free entry, not a family fun atmosphere at all on those evenings.
Extra security was put on, and that costs, big money for the full team required.
And the system you put in place to deal with it was done...gated, secure, safe paid entry!
The pickpocketing...again personal experience.
The only place I have had my pocket picked in a crowded public place, ever...
BPB, Grand National weekend 1995 or 96.
People couldn't get to the queue entrances to queue, I have had to queue for the Big One literally off the park...
Why, because mum, dad, gran, grandad and junior want to queue with Jonny with his two A tickets up to the turnstile, and there are then two or three thousand people waiting near the exit for people on the ride.
It happened, a lot.
On busy summer weekends it could take you an hour to walk a single loop of the park, the main paths were that crowded...with people determined, and proud of the fact, that they weren't giving the Thompson family a single penny.
So they were weeded out.
It should be, pay your tenner or bugger off.
Better than forty or nothing, and safer too.

 

[RevolutionRuleZ]

I am sorry, and I mean this with the upmost respect, but I don't believe that if the park went to free entry, we would see thousands of people, enough to make it so busy it takes an hour to walk across the park, turn up and none of them spend anything. People don't have that much free time on their hands. There are far more attractive places to walk round for those who aren't into rides, or aren't accompanying someone who is using the rides to be.

The parks reactions to your scenarios don't add up to good business sense to me. So to avoid away fans coming in and spending money on rides, we close at 5pm to maintain a family atmosphere by closing the park?! I mean do these away fans now go to the South and Central piers and start ripping the decking up and throwing it through the waltza windows?

Again, one bad experience, which I'm sorry you went through by the way, but that could happen anywhere. I visited a particular area of the country and got jumped after a night out, it doesn't mean it will happen if I return, and certainly didn't put me off returning.

Just because a family are waiting for a kid to queue/ride the Big One doesnt mean they won't later ride the Derby Racer together does it? Not everyone who's not in a queue is a person who isn't spending.

I was a visitor in the 80's and 90's and yes it was busy, but I absolutely loved the buzz of the place, I'd take that over what I saw the weekend before last at about 2pm at FY4.

I mean it doesn't exactly scream family fun or a successful business really.

 

[rob666]

Couldn't agree more that the park is being run poorly, and alternative methods need to be found, but the answer to everything isn't free entry.
The gates were needed.
School trips would not, and did not happen, when it was an open park, on anything like the scale now.
Football was an issue right through the illuminations, every other Saturday, together with massive crowds that often didn't spend much.

 

[RevolutionRuleZ]

It just find it infuriating that such a model worked for over 100+ years, still works in other such parks in the states, and you only have to read comments on social media to see the entry fee is what is stopping people going, that and people having the occasional moan about cash no longer being accepted.

I sometimes find myself questioning do they actually want to make money.

 

[rob666]

They accept cash on the entrance tills, just not in the park.
My bar inside takes cash as well!
The person in charge only wants to play with the ice show, not the rides attached.

 

[RevolutionRuleZ]

They accept cash on the entrance tills, just not in the park.
My bar inside takes cash as well!
The person in charge only wants to play with the ice show, not the rides attached.

I know that, and so do you, but the message to the public is that the park is cashless, which is unfortunately just another reason for people to kick up a fuss.

I honestly don't see any way out of this, the owner will not change her outlook, or her focus. The park is not geared up for a profitable PPR operation even if they wanted it, so its quite clear nothing is going to change.


I guess its a waiting game now, just to see how many more hours can be cut next year and if we will get a full ride line up or go back to the days of seeing random rides SBNO

 

[Sandman]

I am sorry, and I mean this with the upmost respect, but I don't believe that if the park went to free entry, we would see thousands of people, enough to make it so busy it takes an hour to walk across the park, turn up and none of them spend anything. People don't have that much free time on their hands.

Whilst I 100% agree with the sentiment of free entry and the money it could potentially bring in, I'm afraid some people do have that kind of free time on their hands.

Blackpool, which I have the pleasure or displeasure (take your pick) of visiting fairly frequently is quite a hotbed of crime. My best mate and his mrs are both part of the local police force and they are regularly taken away to work in Blackpool, taking away from the local area because of the amount of support Blackpool requires. They have described the place as having the crime rate of a major city... I'm sure it ranks amongst the top 10 highest crime rates in the UK.

I don't mean to judge, but I see first hand the sorts of people that merely wander Blackpool, many often worse for wear and actively looking for trouble. If you visited Blackpool on an average weekend, I would be fairly shocked if you didn't see an 'incident' during your time there.

Honestly, I do think that BPB would see a gradual increase in problematic people and behaviour in the park with free entry. I think you'd get all the younger generation of yobs piling in, the ones that have nothing better to do than hang around outside McDonalds in groups and cause trouble. You'd get some coming in to get pissed for the sake of it too, which I saw quite often as a kid there.

But, I do agree with the fact that the current pricing system is not favourable with the public. BPB should be a place you can visit more casually, because I think along with Sandcastle and South Pier, the south beach area of Blackpool could really regenerate itself as the friendly, family-orientated area of Blackpool away from the stag and hen, chaos riddled centre.

This is why I reckon the place is having an identity crisis.

 

[RevolutionRuleZ]

How about a system where those not wishing to buy a wristband, or equivalent E-ticket or whatever, be charged a smaller amount as has been suggested, but get the value of that back in vouchers/tokens so they can have a couple of rides, or a cuppa, with the option to top up/PPR once inside?

Say a tenner in, that gets you on 2 coasters, or 3-4 of smaller rides, and maybe, once they are enjoying themselves they have the option to pay for more. Alternatively they get a couple of beers of a tenner off merchandise?

Complex but not unachievable with todays technology, and would mean those god forsaken scanners actually serve a purpose.

 

[Dar]

What's interesting about that viewpoint is the lack of any intrinsic value of just being inside the park. You can walk around enjoying the atmosphere, the culinary delights, maybe buy some ride tickets? I'd say that's worth a fiver on its own merits, surely?

Liseberg is a good comparison, they're both city/town parks with both local and tourist visitors. Liseberg has an entry price between £7 and £14, depending on the day, that just gets you in and enjoying being in an amusement park.

I really don't understand the new ticketing system at Blackpool either. Why do I need to scan my phone at every ride? Why do I need to scan anything if everybody in the park has the same ticket? Why do I need to scan anything at all?
Going back to liseberg, they have paper wristbands that you show the op and the ops have a clicker to count riders. Why complicate it?

 

[rob666]

There were an awful lot of staff fiddles in the days of cash and tickets.
You did get "stuff" for your tenner, they had added the River Caves onto the entry, along with the train and maze...and mandy fountain and the stunning Bradleys learning garden.
Scanning is meant to give feedback for operations, but is absolute crap.
Vouchers for food and snacks is the best idea, but the gates really are required, Blackpool is very poor, it is also a hotbed for predatory males, the Beach particularly so.
Posters and details for next years Hot Ice are already out.

 

[RevolutionRuleZ]

I think that is the nearest to an ideal solution then, though I'd not force everyone down the ride of choice being the River Caves, id rather see a PPR selection available once inside as a way of secondary spend, and give those paying simply for entry the option of what combination of rides they wish to use. You do get a lot who want to do the PMBO and then leave (why I don't know) but its important not to miss those kinds of guests, then try entice them with other rides ince they are in.

The less said about the fountain the better, was going into great detail about what I'd do with that area as I took that photo I posted yesterday.

I don't get how a scanner can genuinely give operational feedback. You cant beat having someone like JR lapping the park constantly keeping an eye on things. Take the National, roughly 30-40 people go through the scanners every 5 minutes, is that implying great operations? It could mean the park was dead and the ride was walk on, but the next day the thing had an hour queue and was on 4 trains I doubt you'd get much difference in data due to how bad its run, and its been that was for almost 20 years.

Further to that, certain rides have had capacity crippled since the introduction of wristbands, and nothing has ever been done to improve this, so whats the point in monitoring it. Its just an unnecessary waste of time that slows the loading process down. I wonder how many people will claim for a damaged phone on Valhalla before the year is out? Leaving it in a locker is ideal, but if you need to scan on its not an option.

 

[Coastercal]

Guys the scanner isn’t really for operational feedback. It’s for insurance and claims purposes. If you put a claim against the park of injury then they have evidence you carried on your day. I think this is the biggest factor for them keeping them personally.

 

[rob666]

That and keeping the ice show punters off the rides.
They do get free entry to the park with their ticket, pretty sure.