Could China become the new USA from a theme park perspective?

[Hyde]

China hasn’t overtaken America in terms of overall numbers because it’s got too much caching up to do. In terms of new stuff each year though? China is the place to be.

This is my point guys.

My reasoning being that ALL of these brands are building parks in China. Disney has ShanghaiThis has all happened in the last couple of years really that the western brands have started to make a concerted move on the Chinese market but its coming and its coming soon. And i would bet my bottom dollar after a few years, maybe even a decade+ Universal and Disney will expand again into the Chinese market. The sheer number of people there is just too high to ignore.

It's not even just a matter of number of population for China; the shift towards consumerist culture and rising wages for the middle class makes tourism an industry that would naturally benefit. We see it in the news daily - Tesla building a second gigafactory for increased Chinese sales, smartphone companies posturing for top Chinese sales - all signs point to a growing middle class with more dispensable income.

 

[Ben]

This is my point guys.

If that’s your point, why are you saying something totally different?

 

[Pokemaniac]

@Pokemaniac I get the point you made about American having brands like Disney, Universal, Legoland even Six Flags and those being recognised world wide.
But in my opinion this is going to become increasingly irrelevant to the point of China becoming Theme Park capital of the world.

My reasoning being that ALL of these brands are building parks in China. Disney has Shanghai, Universal has Beijing, Legoland will have Chengdu and Six Flags have 3 resorts coming in the next few years each with 2 or more parks.

I think the point I was trying to make was how Chinese parks don't seem to hold a candle to the American ones in terms of international brand outreach and international tourism. With its enormous number of inhabitants and growing economy (at least until the property bubble bursts) it only makes sense for Chinese parks to have a higher total attendance than the American ones. But that attendance will be almost entirely domestic, with the possible exception of the Western brands. I don't see a Chinese theme park operator expanding to the West the same way as Disney, Universal Six Flags or even Merlin (Legoland) expand to China. Maybe to places like Russia or Turkey, but I'd be mightily surprised to see a Wanda park open in the US, or even to see Golden Horse build a coaster there. China is a great market for Western brands, and probably an even bigger market for its own brands, but it's a little too insular to export its ideas the other way. We'll see a lot of great things going into China, but probably not as much coming out of it.

 

[Gavin]

^ They honestly don't give two s**ts about attracting international visitors. The domestic market is enormous. We're equal parts curiosity and pain in the arse when we show up.

You're right that we won't see Chinese park operators appearing in the West. Not happening. Same with coasters, though, honestly, some smaller parks could probably benefit by looking at what Golden Horse offers these days. One of those inverting spinners, for example, would be a very unique ride and cost sod all.

Fantawild have a park in Iran (not using the Fantawild brand) and OCT are taking over Anka Park in Turkey. I'm willing to bet their name will be nowhere to be seen either.

Those are the kinds of markets they have a good chance of breaking, though more because they're affordable and now have a wealth of experience, not because of the brands themselves.

 

[Pokemaniac]

^ They honestly don't give two s**ts about attracting international visitors. The domestic market is enormous. We're equal parts curiosity and pain in the arse when we show up.

That's probably the gist of it. China could become (or is already?) the new USA from a theme park perspective, namely visitor numbers, number of large parks, and quantity and quality of coasters, but that's only one of the ways to see it. In terms of international desirability and exports of concepts, brands and ideas, or innovation in the industry, it doesn't reach the US to the ankles.

 

[Hixee]

That's probably the gist of it. China could become (or is already?) the new USA from a theme park perspective, namely visitor numbers, number of large parks, and quantity and quality of coasters, but that's only one of the ways to see it. In terms of international desirability and exports of concepts, brands and ideas, or innovation in the industry, it doesn't reach the US to the ankles.

I'd question how much of that international reach is actually the parks though. The reason why the Universal and Disney parks are so well known is because of the brands they carry, not because of the theme parks. People don't give two ****s that it's Universal who own Harry Potter, it could be Louis' Movie Magic in Tolouse, but if they have the chance to go to Hogsmead they're going to flock there.

We're also talking about Universal and Disney as if they're what make the USA the coaster capital of the world. I'd disagree. It's Cedar Point, Magic Mountain, Dollywood, Carowinds, Waldameer, Coney Island, Busch Gardens Williamsburg, etc that are what take them up there. I wonder what proportion of international visitors a park like Carowinds has? I'd wager not many more than, say, Happy Valley Beijing.

I'd step further back though, who's opinion are we asking for? Average family of four, or hardcore enthusiast?

• The former are never going to go to >95% of the parks in the USA, so their opinion of "coaster capital of the world" is a bit skewed, is it not? If they knew more about Europa/Phantasialand, I'm willing to bet they might choose that too. The IPs win though, I suspect.
• The latter, probably just habit and slow rate of change of opinion, but I think they're probably neck-and-neck at the moment. China is building a LOT of stuff, but they're not currently as well publicised in our field of view. That is changing though, always. Especially with people like roomraider keeping us abreast of as much as he can.

Personally, not yet. It's a mindset that I (we) need to work on, but China is harder to travel in than the USA. It's not impossible, by any stretch, but does require a bit more thinking. The public transport is pretty good, but needs more thought than just get in the car and drive. Food, culture and language are all pretty different to what we're used to in the West, and that does take a bit of courage to tackle the first time. That's not to say that I don't think you should try though, and I think that's where I'd like to improve, but also where we all need to improve. It's no harder to get to Beijing than it is California, so there's no excuse really.

It needs time, but I think it'll continue to grow (both from a park, and popularity) perspective.

 

[Hyde]

I'd question how much of that international reach is actually the parks though. The reason why the Universal and Disney parks are so well known is because of the brands they carry, not because of the theme parks. People don't give two :emoji_poop:s that it's Universal who own Harry Potter, it could be Louis' Movie Magic in Tolouse, but if they have the chance to go to Hogsmead they're going to flock there.

We're also talking about Universal and Disney as if they're what make the USA the coaster capital of the world. I'd disagree. It's Cedar Point, Magic Mountain, Dollywood, Carowinds, Waldameer, Coney Island, Busch Gardens Williamsburg, etc that are what take them up there. I wonder what proportion of international visitors a park like Carowinds has? I'd wager not many more than, say, Happy Valley Beijing.

I can't help but imagine the focus would be on boosting domestic attendance of theme parks, versus international travelers. To your point on non-Disney and Universal parks, a vast majority of this attendance is domestic (especially within the immediate 1-2 state radius). In this way, more regional Chinese parks could continue to develop and be focused on city-by-city, province-by-province market development.