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Beyond vertical

I'm in the same boat as most people here, Dive Machine's have amuch better impact than Euro's. Hell the drop on Odyssey is much better than Euro's, and thats only 65'!

But I like Euro Fighters on the basis that they are really good coasters for smaller parks that dont have much of a budget.
 
Kind of unfair to compare Oblivion's 88-degree 180 foot drop to Mumbo Jumbo or Rage.

Both drops are are well under 100 feet tall. Rage is 72 feet tall, and the drop is about 65 feet, whilst Mumbos is nearly 100 feet, the main drop doesn't come near the ground. I'd estimate 75 feet from this picture: http://www.rcdb.com/4308.htm?p=23460

Of course they will be less intimidating. It's a huge difference.

Mav and Fahrenheit are more appropriate comparisons IMHO, but since neither drop into that mist-filled hole, it still isn't completely fair.
 
^ It's not just about Oblivion, however, Sheikra and Griffon and the others don't dive into mist filled holes and I would still say that they are better than what I imagine a Maverick drop would feel like.
 
It all depends on what you enjoy.. and each of those respective drops still don't compare tbh.

Dive Machines give a completely different sensation then rides such as Maverick and Rage. It is basically comparing Floater to Ejector.. which we all know is a touchy subject to some. :p
 
^I agree. I think it falls down to which sort of airtime you prefer.

Personally, I don't think 'beyond-vertical-drops' are that great. I was expecting a very strange sensation on Speed. It actually felt less intense than Oblivion.

I think it's opinion and what you prefer, however I do think it's more of a gimmick.
 
I prefer the B&M dive machine drop to the eurofighter drop, as the eurofighter drop seems to be over too quickly, whereas the B&M dive machine drop is built up and adds tension. I also prefer the holding part of it aswell, as it adds to the drop.
 
Having riden Mumbo Jumbo, I can say that beyond vertical is not as good as vertical. Straight down seems more imposing because the drops are bigger. A large beyond verticle drop would create too high negative Gs unless it was covered in brakes. A vertical drop does not need that and just looks scarier. The experience of the drop is better and if we use DMs as an example, then the holding brake also makes the experience better and scarier.
MJs drop just didnt do anything for me. Oblivions drop is quite possibly my favourite moment on any rollercoaster.
 
I haven't ridden a beyond vertical coaster but I think I've sussed why people prefer Oblivion and SheiKra's drops (The majority that is). Its because its like your falling off a high place. You stop and wait and then all of a sudden your falling and very far. Its the case of you have time to think ****!. Thats the reason, whilst with all beyond vertical drops they send you over the lift hill quickly so you dont have the time to think. Of course there is still the floater/ ejector argument but hey I think this may be why!
 
Also vertical drops are faster. With beyond vertical drops the upstop wheels are running on the track slowing the train down. With true vertical drops the wheels arn't doing too much, just catching you at the bottom. Vertical drops are faster
 
Well the only beyond vertical drops I have been on are Steel Hawg's and Maverick's. And the only vertical drops I have been on is Vertical Velocity, Wicked Twister, TTD, Deja Vu, and SheiKra. I prefer beyond vertical drops I just think they are alot more fun.
 
^^^Mumbo goes round two turns before the drop, so you have almost as much time to think ****!^^^

^^The wheels are always in contact with the track on vertical drops for two reasons-firstly, the drop is not straight, it bends vertical and then bends horizontal again, it never dives in a straight line like Arrow coasters did. Second, wheels are spring loaded keeping them glued to the track at all times. Its why Oblivion's drpo is only 88.8 degrees or whatever it is-spring loaded wheels were not around in 1997 when it was designed, so it could never dive straight down.^^

El Loco models need magnetic brakes on the drops bcause they are so steep, this means the car slows down on the drop, which makes it a bit clunky and not as fun as you would expect. It's still a good drop, but I prefer Oblivion's vertical drop to MJs 112.
 
I think Oblivion's intimidation is caused by other factors. Dive Machines are colossal and Oblivion looks particually opressive.

Mumbo Jumbo isn't as bad as I expected, but I don't rate it either. It's not as fun as a Eurofighter because it feels too controlled and slow. It doesn't feel like a coaster and the elements aren't pleasant. I think that kind of ride would do brilliantly as an indoors coaster with extreme theming. I want Disney to get one.

Eurofighters are popular because they are cheap and extremely cheerful. As an enthusiast, I find it a real shame how rough they are. Saw is ...awful in the afternoon. Just awful. I can't think of many other coasters which are that painfully rough. In the morning, however, it's okay and I actually really like the indoors part of Saw. It just seems a shame that outside the effort was lagging, both in the ride's actual design and the themeing aspect.

Oblivion is only better because it's of a higher standard and quality to begin with. So any EF or, whatever Jumbo's type is called, has got to do a LOT before it can catch up. Mumbo doesn't even try, it's only the second of it's kind and it's just flaunting it's gimmick in hope that's enough when it's just not. Saw failed because needed a better considered layout and more interaction with it's theme.

These rides have the potential to be really good, but no one will take it upon themselves to show off what they are really capable of. And even then, I still doubt they'd better the likes of Griffon and Sheikra.
 
peep said:
So are you like me and find these beyond vertical drops a stupid gimmick?
Click to expand...

To an extent.

Fahrenheit's 97 degree drop is unbelievably amazing. It's the best drop I have ever experienced (Yes, better than El Toro's). Rides like Eurofighters that have 95, 97 degree drops to me, no aren't gimmicks.

Now about these "120 degree drops": Gimmick. I'm sure it's an amazing sensation, but 120 degrees? Really? The way I see it, the manufacturer designs the 100+ degree drop, knowing a park will be interested. Park is interested because they can market it. Park buys the coaster. They market it to no end "OMG!!!11! 120 degrees!!!1!". People see the ads and say they "have to go". It's a success because people flock to it. Park is happy. Manufacturer is happy. All a gimmick.
 
I agree that 120 is a bit much, but slightly over vertical is really quite cool. Farenheit especially so: the 98.6 degree drop (that is right; it was specifically designed to be ~98.6 degrees) makes you feel like you're just falling off the track or out of your seat. Also, though it probably wasn't intended, I think it's worth mentioning 90 degree lift hills, again such as Farenheit. It's quite an interesting sensation to be pressed into the back of your seat like that while going straight up (front seat helps as well :wink: )
 
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