What's new
FORUMS - COASTERFORCE

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

WTF Merlin?

The Woodcutters was one of the better places to eat on park, the food was pretty good and wasn't priced too bad. If it aint broke don't fix it..

It's frustrating as a Hex themed bar & restaurant could actually be awesome, instead it's a half assed effort with a lick of paint, a couple pictures of Hex concept art on the wall and a rediculous menu at extortinate prices.

I bet they will be back to the old menu within a few weeks.
 
I like brioche buns quite a lot, but that doughnut does not look desirable.

Also, the people calling it the worst opening day ever have forgotten 2018.
 
I like brioche buns quite a lot, but that doughnut does not look desirable.

Also, the people calling it the worst opening day ever have forgotten 2018.
I mean, they can't help the snow.

Can't be worse than Blackpool opening in 2019 though. After a day of breakdowns and some of the most unreliable ops I've ever personally experienced, causing very long queues. The day was then topped off with "Sorry PBE, you can't have your planned ERT on Icon, here, have Steeplechase instead." I still had a great day though, I don't think I've ever visited a theme park and not had a great day, even if I've moaned a little. 🙈 🤣
 
I mean, they can't help the snow.

Can't be worse than Blackpool opening in 2019 though. After a day of breakdowns and some of the most unreliable ops I've ever personally experienced, causing very long queues. The day was then topped off with "Sorry PBE, you can't have your planned ERT on Icon, here, have Steeplechase instead." I still had a great day though, I don't think I've ever visited a theme park and not had a great day, even if I've moaned a little. 🙈 🤣
Subbing Steeplechase for Icon... I bet the mood was mutinous. Like subbing ERT on Nemesis for Octonauts.
 
9b163799680758e15166eb6bae1c8bfb.jpg


Oh dear…
 
The sooner Merlin can get rid of Aramark the better the parks will become. Me and my Mum are at Chessington today, multiple units still closed, including Burger Kitchen, and they are continuing to be discriminatory to allergy suffers.
 
Tbf the lack of open units likely can't be pinned solely on Aramark. Merlin always struggled to get F&B units fully staffed. Not quite this early on in the year, and not to the extent they can't open big units, but they struggled. Maybe this has been an inevitability, moreso now with difficulties companies are facing with employment more broadly?

Not to say that Aramark are innocent, but I don't think them disappearing will magically solve any problems.
 
The sooner Merlin can get rid of Aramark the better the parks will become. Me and my Mum are at Chessington today, multiple units still closed, including Burger Kitchen, and they are continuing to be discriminatory to allergy suffers.
I wonder what the Aramark deal is... It may be that the deal is very good for Merlin financially.

Obviously, we've no idea what the actual deal is, so this is all theoretical. But when Derby County bought in Delaware North to handle their match day catering, Delaware North paid a hell of a lot of money (millions) to Derby for those rights. That meant that Derby were guaranteed that income, without having to shoulder any risk.

So given the current economic environment, and how it's been extremely difficult to make a profit with food over the last few years, and with those issues set to continue as costs soar further. If the Aramark deal is similar, in that Aramark bring in their own staff, suppliers, menu etc, and keep all revenue having paid Merlin a large fee for the rights. Merlin may well have come out of this better off than they would have been if they were doing it all themselves.

Remember though, we don't know the actual deal. There is this article, amongst others, that suggest it could be a similar arrangement - https://www.facilitatemagazine.com/...ecures-uk-catering-deal-merlin-entertainments - And if that's the case, and the fee paid to Merlin is a fixed fee rather than a percentage based on profits / turnover... Bloody smart move to be honest, financially, given what has happened since and what we know now about the hospitality and catering industry's challenges ahead.

Anyway, my point is that maybe we're hoping for the wrong thing (because I do agree, the food right now is a joke.) For as long as the arrangement is mutually beneficial, in that Merlin have the security and stability of a fixed income from food, and Aramark have more outlets to 'potentially' make a profit, then I can't see the arrangement ending soon. But why can't Aramark sort out the food offering? It seems to me like they're trying to make every outlet mid, instead of having clear divides between budget, core and premium food offerings. I'd like to see them focus on value for money with the smaller quick serve outlets, and focus on quality, and only quality, regardless of cost, with what I think should be premium outlets, like RCR and Woodcutters (bite me!)

I'd like to see them properly implement 3 tiers like this.

Value: Outlets like the small quick serve places on Towers Street, Dark Forest and Mutiny Bay, Courtyard Hot Dogs and that kind of outlet... These should be cheap and quick rubbish... The focus should be on providing something to fill a hole at the very very best value.

Core: Outlets like The Burger Kitchen, Just Chicken or Explorer's Pizza Pasta Buffet. These are the core outlets, that should provide a good meal, at a reasonable enough price, but without sacrificing too much in the way of quality to achieve that price. If you need to charge a quid more to offer decent chicken instead of the cheapest crap, then do it. But keep the menus simple and wholesome so that you can keep prices reasonable without sacrificing that quality too much.

Premium: Outlets like Woodcutters and Rollercoaster Restaurant. (I'd like to see Welcome-Inn renovated and bought into this category too, if the logistics allowed. Although I've no idea what their kitchen is like, so maybe not.) These are the places you go when you want something nice. If I'm taking time out of a day to sit down and wait for a proper meal, it's because I want to eat something good. These outlets should focus on quality, quality and then quality, regardless of cost, no corners should be cut to save a few quid. If it's £20+ for a meal, then so be it. In this kind of outlet I'd rather pay £25 for an absolutely fantastic meal, (as far as theme park's go) than £15 for something average or below.

This isn't a new concept, all of the best parks in the world are like this, Disney, Universal, Europa Park. But it's something Alton Towers (and I assume other Merlin Parks) seem to be struggling with more and more since Aramark took over, even if it is something they're 'trying' to achieve, they're failing Imo. The value outlets are too expensive, the core outlets are focusing on price at the expense of quality just a little too much, and the premium restaurants are just crap now, with no focus on quality at all, it would seem.
 
Tbf the lack of open units likely can't be pinned solely on Aramark. Merlin always struggled to get F&B units fully staffed. Not quite this early on in the year, and not to the extent they can't open big units, but they struggled. Maybe this has been an inevitability, moreso now with difficulties companies are facing with employment more broadly?

Not to say that Aramark are innocent, but I don't think them disappearing will magically solve any problems.
They're Aramark staff, not Merlins. All catering staff were TUPE'd over to Aramark. It's their responsibility to staff the outlets.

Reading that link I posted above, we can say for sure, regardless of not knowing how Merlin are compensated, that Aramark have full control over catering, they're essentially 'leasing' every food outlet.
 
They're Aramark staff, not Merlins. All catering staff were TUPE'd over to Aramark. It's their responsibility to staff the outlets.

The point I was making (not clearly mind!) was that when it was Merlin, they couldn't staff the units. They tried hiring for F&B staff and could never get enough. Changing the company who does the hiring isn't going to magically fix that unless said new company pays more or offers better benefits (which spoilers, Aramark don't)
 
The point I was making (not clearly mind!) was that when it was Merlin, they couldn't staff the units. They tried hiring for F&B staff and could never get enough. Changing the company who does the hiring isn't going to magically fix that unless said new company pays more or offers better benefits (which spoilers, Aramark don't)
Ahh my mistake. To be fair, I think it's clear enough. It's my fault, I read the merlin part and misinterpreted your point first time around, sorry.

I imagine Aramark pay minimum wage? Pretty standard in hospitality and catering up here, at least as a starting wage. (I know it's probably very different further South.) Although, usually, the people applying for those roles, at minimum wage, want something casual and close to home. :/
 
Off-topic but...

Visited Alton Towers on Friday, park was quiet but lines were still 60 minutes on most of the coasters.

Operations were particularly bad. There was constant stacking on most rides, Galactica had issues with the restraints back row, Spinball sometimes only had one carriage going around, Curse kept closing every hour. Had the park not been open until 8pm we wouldn't have ridden everything.

The food though, absolutely awful. Paid £17 for a Burger, chips and drink. It was like something you'd find in a burger van on an industrial site (or even worse). Also the signage for food sites in Mutiny bay reminded me of Blackpool. And don't get me started on waiting 2 hours for a cardboard pizza at the splash landings hotel.

Had a good time overall, just felt a bit deflated with the standard of food and overall atmosphere of the park. This is supposed to be their premier park, but it's being filled with arcades (which were empty - and again gave Blackpool vibes), awful food options. It's become so commercial, it's definitely lost it's charm.
 
continuing to be discriminatory to allergy suffers.
I’m going to elaborate on this further, if you say you have an allergy they still won’t customise the item (ie: removing the cheese slice, when the rest of the burger was fine for dairy allergy). My Mum has a dairy intolerance. So with Burger Kitchen being closed which has been our normal safe space food option, and the fish and chip shop also being closed. We went over to Pizza Pasta, now at somepoint within the last 12 months they’ve stopped doing the custom dairy free pizzas, and the only item left on the menu for dairy allergy is a risotto which my Mum doesn’t eat.

Minus the food issues, the day at Chessington with her was a good one.
 
I’m going to elaborate on this further, if you say you have an allergy they still won’t customise the item (ie: removing the cheese slice, when the rest of the burger was fine for dairy allergy). My Mum has a dairy intolerance. So with Burger Kitchen being closed which has been our normal safe space food option, and the fish and chip shop also being closed. We went over to Pizza Pasta, now at somepoint within the last 12 months they’ve stopped doing the custom dairy free pizzas, and the only item left on the menu for dairy allergy is a risotto which my Mum doesn’t eat.

Minus the food issues, the day at Chessington with her was a good one.
In a world where Vegans and Vegetarians, who now account for 4.5% of the population, often only get one choice on a menu, they probably don't care. It's easier and safer for them to just not cater for allergies. If you claim something is allergen free, and then make somebody ill, or worse, you're in a world of trouble. When the kitchen is run by inexperienced young people, maybe they decided it wasn't worth the risk.

We have a classically trained head chef, with over 30 years experience, so we can cater for absolutely any dietary requirement, as he has the knowledge and experience to make omissions and substitutions, he can even just make meals up on the spot with what he has, if needed. But even then, we have to warn people that the kitchen is small, not free of any particular allergen, and much of the equipment is used for all allergen containing dishes, so there is a risk of traces from cross contamination. Legally speaking, the only real alternatives are either having all entirely separate (usually purple) equipment, that is used for allergen free food only, which is just not possible in our small kitchen, or just not selling anything with allergens at all, making the entire menu allergen free, which would really limit the menu.

tl;dr There's a lot of responsibility that goes along with serving allergen free food, especially after that Pret / Natasha Ednan-Laperouse case. Some places will always just decide it's not worth the risk. I don't know, but maybe that's what they've done?
 
tl;dr There's a lot of responsibility that goes along with serving allergen free food, especially after that Pret / Natasha Ednan-Laperouse case. Some places will always just decide it's not worth the risk. I don't know, but maybe that's what they've done?
For what it's worth, as an opening caveat to what I'm about to say, I do completely agree with the content of your post. You're absolutely right that great care needs to be taken, especially around potentially fatal conditions (thinking here the high-level differentiation between a nut allergy and, say, lactose intolerance), and in some ways I think it's good that establishments take this seriously enough to essentially just 'not bother' in a lot of cases.

However, that being said, I think there's an element of "captive market" that places like Alton Towers (for example) should be considering properly. If I'm on the high-street I have the choice to go somewhere else, I'd have the option to go to another pub further down the road, etc. I don't think the same is necessarily true at a park. I actually do think that there should be more thought given to this by parks, and whilst I'm not sure quite how to formulate this into words, I do feel like the "it's quite hard so we're not going to bother" approach is really acceptable in 2025.

All of this is said in context that I'm coeliac, and whilst not as 'serious' as a nut allergy, it's debatably more serious than just gluten intolerance. A long while back - shortly after my diagnosis - I decided that I wouldn't let it run my life. I travel a lot, and I can only really do the best I can in a lot of places (how, exactly, do I explain in the middle of Cambodia that I can't have certain types of soy sauce? - I can't, I just have to do my best). I'm lucky that my life wouldn't be at risk if there was some cross-contamination, and I obviously just don't eat things that are clearly going to contain gluten, but I work on that logic generally. Somewhere like your pub sounds like a great example - you can do the usual things that you would do to avoid gluten ending up in my food, but I have to be realistic that I also can't expect you to be able to guarantee anything. I think the responsibility there falls between us - we both just do our best. The Natasha's Law situation is different - pre-packaged, labelled food, with cross-contamination not properly thought about or cared for, is much more dangerous. It's the blessing of EU food labelling, to be honest. Anyway - I digress...
 
For what it's worth, as an opening caveat to what I'm about to say, I do completely agree with the content of your post. You're absolutely right that great care needs to be taken, especially around potentially fatal conditions (thinking here the high-level differentiation between a nut allergy and, say, lactose intolerance), and in some ways I think it's good that establishments take this seriously enough to essentially just 'not bother' in a lot of cases.

However, that being said, I think there's an element of "captive market" that places like Alton Towers (for example) should be considering properly. If I'm on the high-street I have the choice to go somewhere else, I'd have the option to go to another pub further down the road, etc. I don't think the same is necessarily true at a park. I actually do think that there should be more thought given to this by parks, and whilst I'm not sure quite how to formulate this into words, I do feel like the "it's quite hard so we're not going to bother" approach is really acceptable in 2025.

All of this is said in context that I'm coeliac, and whilst not as 'serious' as a nut allergy, it's debatably more serious than just gluten intolerance. A long while back - shortly after my diagnosis - I decided that I wouldn't let it run my life. I travel a lot, and I can only really do the best I can in a lot of places (how, exactly, do I explain in the middle of Cambodia that I can't have certain types of soy sauce? - I can't, I just have to do my best). I'm lucky that my life wouldn't be at risk if there was some cross-contamination, and I obviously just don't eat things that are clearly going to contain gluten, but I work on that logic generally. Somewhere like your pub sounds like a great example - you can do the usual things that you would do to avoid gluten ending up in my food, but I have to be realistic that I also can't expect you to be able to guarantee anything. I think the responsibility there falls between us - we both just do our best. The Natasha's Law situation is different - pre-packaged, labelled food, with cross-contamination not properly thought about or cared for, is much more dangerous. It's the blessing of EU food labelling, to be honest. Anyway - I digress...
I agree 100%. But on a 'park wide' basis, not at every outlet. There should be options, for every requirement, somewhere. It's still not ideal, and must be infuriating for guests who have these dietary requirements, to have to go on a treasure hunt to find a meal. But on the flipside, I think it would be unreasonable to expect it at every outlet. (I note that coasterfreck's normal go to is closed at the moment, and that is what's caused the issue in the first place here, Aramark's operational issues.)

Natasha's Law had implications for us too, the new laws that came about around that time affected all hospitality food, not just pre packaged. Whether the changes were officially under the Natasha's Law banner or not, that's essentially when everything was tightened up, and rightly so. The biggest problem for us now, is that we cannot provide menus that show you which meals are gluten free, (or any other allergen) because of the risk of traces from cross contamination. Nothing can be guaranteed as being totally free of gluten, even if it contains no gluten in the ingredients. If you use flour in the kitchen at all, it's an aerosol, so potentially everything is contaminated. Some places seem to get away with it by using clever phrases like 'None gluten containing Ingredients Menu' with a disclaimer at the bottom about cross contamination. But when we tried that, we were told by our EHO that the risk of somebody not reading that small print is too high, and we'd be best advising people on an individual basis, explaining that we can make meals without gluten, providing the allergen matrix, but also highlighting the fact that there is still the risk of trace amounts.

The good thing for you is that Gluten is the main one, we probably serve one or two a day with a gluten intolerance or full coeliac. We have lots of people come to us regularly with coeliacs, because they trust us, even though we still have to give that same warning every time. For the other 13 reportable allergens, lactose / cow's milk (I know they're seperate, grouped together as they require similar handling.) and nuts are the next most common, maybe 1, or 2 a month, at a push. The rest are less than a handful a year. Soy is very rare, but still one of the 14.
 
Back
Top