It's almost like they planned it that way, recognizing Paramount underinvested on roller coasters and left a gap of large, steel coasters.
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Kings Island | Orion | B&M Giga Coaster
- Thread starter Pear
- Start date
Catmaydo
Roller Poster
It's literally nothing like Leviathan. This has more of a focus on airtime hills, and twister elements. Don't get me wrong, Leviathan is really fun, but Orion's layout is what I wish the former was.
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Antinos
Slut for Spinners
Are we talking about the same Leviathan? Considering that Leviathan has more airtime hills and has more or less the same amount of twistiness, I don't think your statement holds much water.
First piece of track arrives on site:
The first piece of track for the new Orion roller coaster opening spring 2020 was delivered today. It won't be long before construction crews begin erecting the ride. #KingsIsland #KI2020 pic.twitter.com/Fllf6c4ptH
— Kings Island (@KingsIslandPR) August 16, 2019
John Knotts
Mega Poster
So what if it’s like Leviathan? Is that not a worthy coaster to take inspiration from? I’d be more worried if it were similar to MF.
Catmaydo
Roller Poster
Admittedly after rewatching the video, Orion only has one more big hill, but the treble clef (or whatever you want to call it) and the first massive turnaround seem like they might be more fun than Leviathan's overbanked turns.
Essentially, I like the look of it, and I think it'll be a fairly different experience to Leviathan. The comparison just seemed a bit too dismissive to me.
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Essentially, I like the look of it, and I think it'll be a fairly different experience to Leviathan. The comparison just seemed a bit too dismissive to me.
Sent from my G8441 using Tapatalk
Antinos
Slut for Spinners
Alright, I've digested Orion enough where I can sufficiently convey my thoughts on the ride.
As of now, I'm pretty lukewarm on the ride and much of my disappointment stems from how the ride was presented. As was mentioned last night, the park forgot to turn on their live stream of the announcement and took almost 30 minutes to launch the microsite. As I dug into the details, I actually couldn't believe some of the claims they listed. Eight hills? Yeah...counting the lift, every turn, AND the brake run. They included some other strange metrics as well, like arc length of the entire drop...why? And the presentation itself was underwhelming. I recall back to Banshee's announcement when everything just hit perfectly - the mood, the intro spiels, the reveal, and then a hefty amount of follow up material covering numerous details of the ride. Banshee's announcement was a benchmark that very few rides in general have lived up to since, and the park certainly didn't live up to providing the same perfect experience for both Mystic Timbers and Orion as they did for Banshee. But that's just Kings Island being up to shenanigans.
As for the coaster itself...287 feet tall, 300 feet tall, or 325 feet tall, it doesn't matter all that much - Orion is still enormous. That 300 foot drop will be fantastic like its sisters' drops and it should showcase its speed nicely...but it still just doesn't feel right. I shouldn't judge on renderings, but it just seems sluggish. The transitions lack the snappiness and power exhibited on Leviathan, and especially on Fury. Everyone seems to be excited for the first 90 degree banked hill because they think it's a wave turn and it isn't. I think everyone is expecting the ride to kick them out of their seats in RMC fashion and the element simply isn't profiled that way. I'm not even convinced that the element will exhibit true weightlessness since it curves slightly to the left and will force riders into their seats more than anything. The turnaround also exhibits uninspired, conservative dynamics. It rises, banks, turns, and dives with zero spice whatsoever - it is purely vanilla. They could have made the run out much more exciting by simply tightening up the transitions to make the train snap into and out of each element. They could have cooked up some strange lead-in to the turnaround - maybe something where they roll the train overbanked, then maybe unbank a bit for some strange airtime, and then bank into the turn again, just to give the element some semblance of life. And the jury is out on the hills - the animation makes the return run look fairly drawn out, but the hills will likely be fine though.
The whole package from initial presentation to the ride itself just looks uninspired, conservative, and generic...especially the final helix and final turn. There doesn't appear to be any inspiration or innovation whatsoever - just completely textbook and totally standard as they could possibly get with an absence of the subtlties that will actually throw your body about your seat. I honestly wasn't expecting the park to announce a 9,000 foot Fury beater - just something with more vigor. The entire thing feels like Kings Island sort of phoned it in to appease the hordes of fanboys screaming for a giga coaster...and if that's the case, then that's really sad.
On a positive note, y'all can probably guess that I adore the color scheme. The renderings show that this corner of the park is going to look gorgeous with Racer's white hills in the foreground and Orion's striking blue splines making up the skyline. The aesthetic is going to be fantastic.
Also worth noting is that Kings Island has not figured out how to take care of their B&Ms. While Canada's Wonderland and Carowinds have figured something out and have actually improved their Beemers over the years, Banshee and Diamondback are sadly shadows of their former selves. Banshee's rattle gets worse every season on all three trains and Diamondback yields the same rattle with the addition of pacing issues. I certainly hope the park figures something out such that Orion does not head down that same path, because I can't imagine the B&M rattle is pleasant at 91mph.
So if you actually read through all of that...yes, it is some pretty heavy, but (in my opinion) valid criticism. Despite it, I TRULY hope to be delightfully surprised when I get to ride it next spring. I hope testing footage shows the ride absolutely tearing through the layout with a fantastic pace, and I honestly hope there's some hidden physics trickery sprinkled throughout the layout, but there doesn't appear to be any indication of that. I really want to like this ride and I really want it to be good...but I don't want to get my hopes up either.
As of now, I'm pretty lukewarm on the ride and much of my disappointment stems from how the ride was presented. As was mentioned last night, the park forgot to turn on their live stream of the announcement and took almost 30 minutes to launch the microsite. As I dug into the details, I actually couldn't believe some of the claims they listed. Eight hills? Yeah...counting the lift, every turn, AND the brake run. They included some other strange metrics as well, like arc length of the entire drop...why? And the presentation itself was underwhelming. I recall back to Banshee's announcement when everything just hit perfectly - the mood, the intro spiels, the reveal, and then a hefty amount of follow up material covering numerous details of the ride. Banshee's announcement was a benchmark that very few rides in general have lived up to since, and the park certainly didn't live up to providing the same perfect experience for both Mystic Timbers and Orion as they did for Banshee. But that's just Kings Island being up to shenanigans.
As for the coaster itself...287 feet tall, 300 feet tall, or 325 feet tall, it doesn't matter all that much - Orion is still enormous. That 300 foot drop will be fantastic like its sisters' drops and it should showcase its speed nicely...but it still just doesn't feel right. I shouldn't judge on renderings, but it just seems sluggish. The transitions lack the snappiness and power exhibited on Leviathan, and especially on Fury. Everyone seems to be excited for the first 90 degree banked hill because they think it's a wave turn and it isn't. I think everyone is expecting the ride to kick them out of their seats in RMC fashion and the element simply isn't profiled that way. I'm not even convinced that the element will exhibit true weightlessness since it curves slightly to the left and will force riders into their seats more than anything. The turnaround also exhibits uninspired, conservative dynamics. It rises, banks, turns, and dives with zero spice whatsoever - it is purely vanilla. They could have made the run out much more exciting by simply tightening up the transitions to make the train snap into and out of each element. They could have cooked up some strange lead-in to the turnaround - maybe something where they roll the train overbanked, then maybe unbank a bit for some strange airtime, and then bank into the turn again, just to give the element some semblance of life. And the jury is out on the hills - the animation makes the return run look fairly drawn out, but the hills will likely be fine though.
The whole package from initial presentation to the ride itself just looks uninspired, conservative, and generic...especially the final helix and final turn. There doesn't appear to be any inspiration or innovation whatsoever - just completely textbook and totally standard as they could possibly get with an absence of the subtlties that will actually throw your body about your seat. I honestly wasn't expecting the park to announce a 9,000 foot Fury beater - just something with more vigor. The entire thing feels like Kings Island sort of phoned it in to appease the hordes of fanboys screaming for a giga coaster...and if that's the case, then that's really sad.
On a positive note, y'all can probably guess that I adore the color scheme. The renderings show that this corner of the park is going to look gorgeous with Racer's white hills in the foreground and Orion's striking blue splines making up the skyline. The aesthetic is going to be fantastic.
Also worth noting is that Kings Island has not figured out how to take care of their B&Ms. While Canada's Wonderland and Carowinds have figured something out and have actually improved their Beemers over the years, Banshee and Diamondback are sadly shadows of their former selves. Banshee's rattle gets worse every season on all three trains and Diamondback yields the same rattle with the addition of pacing issues. I certainly hope the park figures something out such that Orion does not head down that same path, because I can't imagine the B&M rattle is pleasant at 91mph.
So if you actually read through all of that...yes, it is some pretty heavy, but (in my opinion) valid criticism. Despite it, I TRULY hope to be delightfully surprised when I get to ride it next spring. I hope testing footage shows the ride absolutely tearing through the layout with a fantastic pace, and I honestly hope there's some hidden physics trickery sprinkled throughout the layout, but there doesn't appear to be any indication of that. I really want to like this ride and I really want it to be good...but I don't want to get my hopes up either.
TLARides
Hyper Poster
tomahawk
Strata Poster
Kw6sTheater
Hyper Poster
Some people have pointed out that Fury 325's animated POV didn't show a trim, whereas the ride ended up having one. I hope this isn't the case, but I think it very well could be.
JJLehto
Hyper Poster
Looks cool, it will be fun, but it's deff a bit of a letdown. It's true, knowing what Fury is/what a B&M giga can be...to go back to "standard B&M hyper" but faster and taller...tad disappointing. It is indeed generic and cookie cutter. I've heard some say "well whats wrong with a cookie cutter, cookies are great!" and yes but eh, we're enthusiasts for a reason lol
I agree, it'll be a fine ride, and hey least they TRIED to branch out with the wave turn (attempt?) and helix in the middle. Maybe it'll have force for once!
I agree, it'll be a fine ride, and hey least they TRIED to branch out with the wave turn (attempt?) and helix in the middle. Maybe it'll have force for once!
Youngster Joey
Strata Poster
To Those who have ridden Shambhala and it's Ampersand. Does having essentially that element on a Giga scale not excite you? I can see why people are dissapointed but it's still a giga and even a bad giga is better then a large majority of coasters on the planet.
Hutch
Strata Poster
If that were the case, we'd see a lot more big airtime hills... and honestly that'd be more exciting for me.
I'd easily prefer several old school camelbacks on a giga rather than a couple airtime hills and lots of turns and corners. That's kind of why I don't rate Fury as high as some of the other B&M hypers I've done. The big camelbacks are more my style.
I will say, I'm more excited for Candymonium than Orion. I just looked at Candy's layout again and that ride honestly looks more fun. More airtime hills, a wild exit on the helix, plus that whole area will likely look much nicer than Orion's.
HeartlineCoaster
Theme Park Superhero
Nope.
MLDesigns
Hyper Poster
@Antinos knocks it out of the park again. Agree with every bit of that.
It just looks incredibly bland, especially with the far turnaround and the big speed-bleeding helix. No spice whatsoever, just B&M being "safe" again. I'm sure the speed hill and the large hill will be pretty good, but man. I can't help but think how much more this could have been.
It just looks incredibly bland, especially with the far turnaround and the big speed-bleeding helix. No spice whatsoever, just B&M being "safe" again. I'm sure the speed hill and the large hill will be pretty good, but man. I can't help but think how much more this could have been.
Antinos
Slut for Spinners
I think we're going to have to go to Japan to get a fix of that.
Kw6sTheater
Hyper Poster
Orion is certainly not a bad addition by any means, but the fact that Cedar Fair didn't use the long piece of land occupied merely by trees in between Racer and Beast (see: photo 1) as well as the opportunity to go deeper into the woods where Beast lurks (see: photo 2) is a bit disappointing. If this was due to the increased cost of having the coaster swoop into steep slopes of the latter plot and also to not ruin the isolated Beast experience, that's quite understandable; however, I feel that had King's Island utilized at least the area behind Racer for some sort of turnaround (see: photo 1) this would have allowed for a taller, faster and longer ride. I've heard rumors that the reasoning behind Orion's shorter layout is due to the rougher terrain that Beast weaves through - according to some data from Google Earth, it seems to be quite a steep drop-off of around 50 feet downhill from Racer's turnarounds all the way back to Beast's 2nd lift hill. That being said, though, there's still some flat land directly behind Racer and that abandoned theater - however, Beast's covered mid course brake run is quite close by. To wrap this rather long post up, I can't help but feel a little underwhelmed when a park has the chance to do something truly spectacular that deviates from the norm, yet doesn't embrace it. Was King's Island in the wrong by choosing to go with the smallest giga coaster yet, rather than a humongous Fury-beater that zips through the treetops? Certainly not! Though many other enthusiasts, including myself, would have gone wild over a giga that uses the unique terrain and forested setting that King's Island has on offer, and one even larger than Fury would've enticed us even further.
Photo 1 - This is long piece of land behind Racer that stretches to Beast and Vortex. It's around 5 acres of room. The terrain gets decently steep on the right hand side, with about a 20 foot downhill slope from Racer to Vortex.
Photo 2 - This is the other piece of land that Orion could have utilized. I've heard that King's Island owns all the land up to the Miami River (a bit over 600 acres). You can see the service road that runs parallel to Beast; I'd envision that Orion could have been a much longer ride, had King's Island utilized even some of this land for an extra airtime hill out and another one coming back.
