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Europa Park |"Wodan"| GCI Wood

CoasterCrazy

Giga Poster
Crazycoaster said:
^ Damn someone having a similar name to mine! :p I don't remember saying the ride would test soon furie!

Remember me??

But the ride will test soon...

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...With trains around...

And some cool shots fromGCI'S facebook page (http://www.facebook.com/GreatCoasters#! ... rs?sk=wall)...

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WXHNe.jpg
 

Ben

CF Legend
People do realise I was agreeing with CoasterCruiser, right?

Still hate how it goes round the other coasters <//3
 

furie

SBOPD
Staff member
Administrator
Moderator
Ben said:
People do realise I was agreeing with CoasterCruiser, right?

Yes, which is why I couldn't understand why people suddenly started having a go at him, other than the fact he was impolite about your joke ;)
 

Brett7710

Mega Poster
^Agreed, they could definatly have continued the descent into the curve before having to climb out of it to clear over the top of Blue Fire. That part really doesn't look typical of GCI, it's not even like Wodan gets a headchopper out of it either.
 

Brett7710

Mega Poster
^I see what your saying, judging from the top picture the supports already look very wide. I'd imagine they could reinforce the structure using various techniques if there were any concerns though.

Hopefully the ride will be going a fair speed in this section so it won't be too noticable, it's also quite heavily banked.
 

Ben

CF Legend
^They could have solved all that by building this in one of the hundred other places they could have put it, rather than on top of their last ride <//3
 

Brett7710

Mega Poster
UC said:
^...or they could save money by just making it a regular turn, instead of going through unconventional methods to reinforce the track for the sake of a short drop.
Agreed, other than you referring to it as a regular turn, regular maybe 20 years ago from a different company. But compared to recent GCI's it looks sub-standard, it may well have been done for very good reasons and i'm sure it will ride well regardless, but theres no denying that it stands out and looks boring amongst the rest of their layouts.
 

Nemesis Inferno

Strata Poster
The turn does look a bit bland... It's like, why is it so straight and uninteresting when usually GCI's have more random small drops...
 

Crazycoaster

Giga Poster
I'm not entirely sure where else exactly they could build this ride though?

Granted I'm not too clued up on the exact land that Mack own in the area, but from experience of going there and from looking at aerial photos, I can't see many other places they could fit the ride in.

I mean there is plenty of land, but everywhere I look would be a logistical nightmare in terms of access from the park. They have a field behind Poseidon, and access could come from where they have the events stage (next to the big-ass satellite dish), but other than that, I can't see where else they can go, without the backstage buildings getting in the way anyway..

This is a genuine question, I'd be interested to know where else they have room for expansion.
 

marc

CF Legend
I found Europa a bit strange anyway.

The theming and layout in parts was amazing then after the Wild Mouse they just seem to have given up and it went very RCT.

I can see what Ben means now, they had so much space to build this coaster but have gone for interacting with other rides and it does not fit the theme in the slightest with the other rides.
 

Brett7710

Mega Poster
UC said:
What do you mean "20 years ago from a different company?" Do you mean that it's not "regular" by GCI standards?
I thought the following line: "But compared to recent GCI's it looks sub-standard" made it clear that's what I was referring to. Apoloigies if the full stop placing confused you but please don't make me refer you back to your own points about linking related sentences.

UC said:
I meant "regular" as in "generic," not in terms of GCI. As in, it looks like something you'd find on RCT.
I would say the term Generic is hard to place when it comes to coasters since different manufacturers have their own style and designs, which is why I assumed you were using the using the term more specifically, the point was that as 'generic' as the turn may look in your opinion, it isn't generic or regular at all compared to other GCI designs. Also I think I know what youre getting at with the RCT idea, but it seems odd to use the reference when discussing what a 'generic' element of a real coaster might look like, RCT designs in the most part are notoriously unrealistic.
 

Brett7710

Mega Poster
UC said:
Yes, but when you misunderstand someone in the first place, you lose all ability to further clarify your point.
My 'further clarification' as you call it, was me quoting what I had already written, you simply failed to acknowledge it the first time around.

UC said:
You then proceeded to take said analysis in a direction that I had not meant it.
Maybe that could have been avoided if you had followed another of your top rules and made your post clear. "You're on an online forum, therefore, you must be specific in the things you say. It is not our job to interpret what you mean - it's your job to clarify from the start."

This whole debate could have been avoided, but even if you hadn't been more specific in the first instance, this sentence would have cleared it up on its own
UC said:
Perhaps "generic" wasn't the best of words to choose
You've admitted in your reply that YOU didn't make your post clear due to a poor choice in words, and yet you still completly blame me for 'my misunderstanding.'

I can see no point in continuing the blame game with you as it's clear that we're not going to get anywhere with it.

I didn't at any point say that this type of turn wasn't used by different manufacturers, on the contrary I actually said that this looks like a turn "from a different company" I didn't even say that your reference to RCT was incorrect in any way, I simply stated it was an odd reference to use, you clearly prefer to use to real-life examples normally.

Take another look at your 'bonus points' and you can see where my original point - "they could definatly have continued the descent into the curve before having to climb out of it to clear over the top of Blue Fire" - came from.
Your example number 1 - The track on the curve nearest to you is already as close to the ground as they can build without digging a trench. But when you look at the taller banked turn towards the back of the ride, which bears more similaritys which the turn on Wodan since it is slighty earlier in the ride and a taller element, you can see that they have created a much more interesting turn.

Your second example has no relevence, its only similarity is the fact that it is a banked corner, the curve follows the profile of the terrain and then continues to ascend. It is not a tall turn which remains at the same height throught the curve, as on Wodan.

The last two examples are right at the end of the ride when the track is at its lowest points to allow the trains to maintain speed. Which again shares nothing in common with Wodan other than banking.

I am well aware that banking is used on coasters to reduce lateral forces on riders and reduce stress and wear on trains. It doesn't alter the fact that it is a strange design choice from GCI and not typical of them to build a turn that flat so early in the ride.

BTW, it was probably wise to edit the end of your post, it just sounded downright arrogant.
 

Brett7710

Mega Poster
In my second post in this discussion I stated:
"I see what your saying, judging from the top picture the supports already look very wide. I'd imagine they could reinforce the structure using various techniques if there were any concerns though."

You can see at that stage I had already recognised the fact that there are limitations on the plot with regards to placement of supports. I'll be the first to admit that i'm not educated to a professional level in engineering matters or the designing of a Roller coaster which i'm sure at this stage you are well aware of, but that type of knowledge isn't essential to give an opinion that the supports could potentially have been be reinforced, you've referred in your post to more A-frame supports being required to support the incline, I don't see why it would be impossible, instead of adding further supports, to reinforce the ones that are in the design, whether they acheived that by something as simples as increasing the gauge of timber, or using other methods that i'm sure could have been thought of.

Roller coaster engineers have pushed technology and found ways to overcome structural limitations since the very first Roller coasters were built, I simply don't agree that there is nothing that could have been done to allow for a more exciting design on this portion of the ride.

If you think I am trying to 'portray myself' as anything more that I am or 'Take on' anyone then you are mistaken. You may feel the need to attack my character when you barely know a think about me and have never met me, I could easily make several comments about your attitude if I felt the need but I have not.

Surely as 'Someone who does understand these things' you could put your knowledge to use and think of what could have been done from an engineering perspective to make an alternate design possible instead of just attacking me for the idea.
 

Brett7710

Mega Poster
It all comes down to our different points of view.
You look at the plot and analyze it from the perspective of an engineer, you can see what is going to be restrictive and your background also means that you have an idea of the cost's involved to do what is neccisary to overcome these restriction. Therefore when you see the completed design you identify the sacrifices that have been made in the process and you're not going to see it as a missed oppertunity, because you understand that there was good reason that it turned out the way it has.

I look at the design as a consumer, a potential visitor of the park who has seen the manufacturer's previous work. I see an aspect of the design that doesn't look as dynamic as similar parts of previous projects. I don't assume that the manufacturer are simply slacking, I too can assume that the limitations created by the plot and budget were the reason the design turned out the way it did. But because I don't have to count the cost of the project and I wouldn't have been the one having to come up with solutions to make an alternate design possible, I still compare it to previous projects and see a missed oppertunity.

It is ignorance caused by a lack of background knowledge, but this is something that I will share with most people who visit the park, except as you already stated most others wouldn't care or even notice. After all, the coaster is just fine as it is, whether I'm still slightly dissapointed after riding it, only time will tell.
 
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